Why Non-Alcoholic Drinks Are Trending With the Sober Curious | Ep. 138

Non-alcoholic spirits and cocktails are everywhere, but why are they suddenly blowing up? From millennials skipping booze to bars charging $20 for an NA cocktail, the rise of “sober curious” culture has everyone talking.

In this episode of Arsenic Culture, Matt, Jason, Drew, and Pierre dig into the world of NA beverages: who’s buying them, why they’re trending, and whether they’re worth the hype (or the price).
Would you actually order a non-alcoholic cocktail at a bar?


#NonAlcoholicDrinks #SoberCurious #ArsenicCulture

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Transcript

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I think, I think a big aspect. I'll take a virgin screwdriver. You, Me too. I drink that you know, for breakfast. Yeah. Every day. A big aspect of that a regular screwdriver for breakfast. every day. Welcome to Arsenic culture. I'm Matt. I'm Jason. I'm Drew. I'm still Pierre. There we go. Uh, we're hanging out and having conversations and talking about how I gotta work out 11 o'clock in the morning tomorrow and we've been recording all night workout's, not the right. Thanks to all these I gotta a workout tomorrow. too. Meaning wake up. Yeah. Have you all had anything to drink tonight? No. No, they don't. That's good because, uh, I'm gonna talk about non-alcoholic, alcoholic beverages. Nice. Uh, okay. are, they are surging in popularity right now. Like, like really good. Like they're huge. But why millennials? Yeah. Like, I feel like that's the end of the episode. That's a good question. Like, not, oh, Yeah. I'm, I'm gonna, I'm They charge you the Same though, if you go out and get a drink. So, dude. So like, and there's places in, uh, California where Non Danny Trejos Place, hill place, God, shots fired. let's not talk kill us. Don't kill us. quick shot. Yeah. No, but uh, yeah, there's places in California you go to bars where like, yeah, they'll charge you as much for a non-alcoholic cocktail. As they would for like a regular cocktail. Are they using like fresh botanicals and stuff in that? You know what I mean? Like it's, I know it's hard to know, right? Honestly. Yeah. Like honestly I think they are. Yeah. But like at the same time, it's just like I can make you an orange juice that's like really good and it uses really good oranges. I wouldn't charge you $25 for it. I would if you'd pay it. Yeah, that's So that's the point. That's the point, right. It's just like there are people that, there's a whole generation right now that doesn't wanna drink. I get it. Okay. There's a lot of downsides to alcohol. There's a lot of upsides too. I don't know if y'all know about 'em, but, uh, you don't wanna drink, that's cool. But. Is it predatory to like start charging$15 for like a non-alcoholic martini? Yeah.'cause the alcohol should cost more than the ingredients. It's, it's in it, you know. Well, I think a big factor. factor it probably Two two-thirds of the cost. Yes. And I think A big factor in that is honestly, some of these non-alcoholic spirits and things like that are more pricey. Yeah. Depending on what they are. Like, you obviously have budget ones and there's options you can go and buy that are cheaper, but there's also options that. are much more expensive. So yeah, Like the, the social aspect of drinking, is it it awesome? Yes, but that's the thing. It's like, that's actually true. is part of that. Like Yeah. How it makes you feel like, let's not mince words here. When you go out and drink, you wanna get a feeling right. you Drink to feel good. Yeah. I you don't have to get drunk. You don't have to get wasted, relax. But drinking makes you feel good. Yeah, I mean it's, it's naturally about this in the earlier episode. It's the social lubricant. Okay. So like if you go out and you're drinking non-alcoholic beverages, like are you getting the social benefit from that? I understand the health benefit. I really do. Okay. Um, I understand why people want to drink in a beverages. They want some sort of connection with drinking without. Drinking. Okay. But if you're gonna go out, you're gonna get charged 15, $20 for a beverage. Like, well, another thing of that is you're just like there's a disconnect getting The same calories I mean, essentially, you're right? Like so you're I would think You're getting like, I mean M alcohol, so whatever the calories. That is true. Everything else, like a mixed drinks, you have a lot of sweetness factor in there. They got a lot of mixers in if you're using like juices and stuff like that. think of a screwdriver. Like if you make that, so it's orange juice and vodka. like orange just have orange juice. right. I mean, what would you do? I think, I think a big aspect. I'll take A virgin screwdriver, You, me too. I drink that you know, for breakfast. Yeah. Every day. But a big aspect of that is. screwdriver the Social, aspect, like you just wanna fit in with the people you're drinking. with. Yeah. You know, You go out to the bar, it's like, eh, let me have a couple of drinks. but nobody, but I'm not drinking. and everybody knows I'm not drinking, so what can I do? When you Get this botanical mixed, you know, orange juice, essentially like you said. And it's like, oh, I'm drinking, I'm having a. cocktail. But to be honest though, If you had a glass this size and it was covered like it was dark, you know, outside, I wouldn't know if you're drinking water. or Mixed drinks. Of course. Throw A little straw in there. I have a lime wedge or something. Yeah. I have no idea. I don't. You have water. Yeah. Right. And it would be, the same thing. I'd be like, oh, you're just having cocktail. I've done, I've done that before. Actually social, like for work, If we're at like cocktail hour and stuff, I'm like, I'm not drinking eight cocktails with you. all. I'll drink two. I'll switch the water here. and there. I'll just keep my little straw my lime in there. Like keep going. And I, and I get that. So from a social standpoint, if you want to take a stand, you don't want to drink you the royal, you just like a person. I think you're singling me out. but okay. am. I'm looking actually directly into your actually I'm pasty white eyes. He called you Even though I don't, I am royal Yeah. I'm very royal. But like, if you want take a stand, you, you don't want to drink, um, you still want to feel like you're a part of the, the gang. Okay. Drinking water is not going to give you that feeling. hanging The wrong crowd though. If you don't feel a part, that's another aspect of it. Like maybe you need to like figure out what you wanna do. But again, like I get it, you're going out with work. Let's say people from work, they're like, you wanna come hang out drinking water? Even if it's in a nondescript glass that is opaque, you're still not gonna feel like you fit in if you drink a mocktail. I get that. You I don't feel like I fit in any, anyway. I know, dude. I'm trying here. Dude, I'm It's, it's like. being the vapor In the group of smokers. Yeah. if you really, If you look at it that, way, I just Like picking on that actually. I mean, it's the truth though. It's like it's either you're the non-smoker or you're the vaper because if you don't smoke, then you automatically sort of feel weird. out there With those group of people when I could just be sitting. inside. In honesty though, I think it's probably for the people that wanna fit in, like you said. Yeah, it's more, it's more of those, you want a little flavor, like you don't just want water. So you want a flavor of what everybody else's tasting, so Everybody else is drinking, ma. ties. I want a virgin ma tie or whatever. I wanna try that and see how it tastes, but I don't want to get drunk. I'm not, I'm not drinking alcohol. Not so I get it. I get it. But also, if you're paying $8 for your drink, I shouldn't pay seven 50, you know? what I mean? Like, and That's the thing. Come on. Yeah. That's the thing. Well, um, Alex Thompson at LeDroit, sorry, prestige LeDroit, uh, distributing, um. Thanks to him for some of the alcohol we have here. Sorry, non-alcohol. Is that your cousin's husband is my cousin house. Oh yeah. House. I know him. Yeah, I know him from earlier rep episode. Yeah. Um, so that's a Kentucky thing of you to say, yeah, we, uh, Joe, we only get to see each other once every couple years. Uh, and we had the pleasure of seeing him a couple weeks ago, uh, down at the beach. And so, uh, from his distributorship, they brought down a ton of stuff. And, uh, some of these things are. Uh, this phony Negroni from St. Reus. Yeah. And, uh, it looks pretty good. It's actually a pretty cool looking bottle. Yeah. And Amma Falso also from, from the same, uh, yeah. Place. And they have some other flavors. These are just the two that I brought tonight. Um, these are non-alcoholic. These are non-alcoholic. Um, they have a mezcal Negroni, which is interesting. Okay. And they have with a alcohol. I mean, mezcal, I mean, Right? No, no. It's a non, they're all non, they're on mezcal. Yeah. Adjacents Danny Trejo Mezcal. I got, I got, I'm falling like mezcal. The wheels are turning slow. But they're slow. Yeah. But you know, and so they've got like, I think four different flavors that at least that we got, but, um, you know, they, they're in an attractive bottle. Some people would do, you know, weird things with these bottles. They want to. Yeah. But, um, so, so we're gonna taste these, um. As like straight up just the NA version sign. Right. And then we're going to mix alcohol with our alcohol and just to see how they mix, right? Yeah. Yeah. It's almost like a pre-made mix, right? So you're like, Hey, I can just go ahead and get this done. Um, again, this bottle of St. George Valley Gin also came from Alex, and you can talk about our sponsors Never say Die, our official sponsor. Appreciate you guys for sponsoring us. Uh, never say di dye Bourbon is delicious. You can get it at most liquor stores, I'm assuming. of 'em that I know of. yeah. Yeah. Um, very good stuff. Uh, check 'em out online in, in your store. and Thanks. for Yeah, And, uh, thanks for letting them use our, uh, the brick house, which is where we add this Airbnb. You can get, uh, downtown Lexington. Um, you can check it@atpartyhouse.com. Used to go on the right side o s.com and, uh, the one we're in the brick house is actually two houses. They joined together. With a really fancy, uh, kitchen and a, uh, glass partition. And the most washed episode we have right now, Jason, uh, was the, uh, old Forest, the old forester scam was actually we were waxing poetic in Yeah. Yeah. You can check out that episode. Uh, So, I had to look up Negroni. so do you know what's in Negroni map? Uh, I, I don't actually. It's a bit, it's a bitter beverage. It's a bitter beverage. sweet vermouth gin And orange peel. That's what, that's what, uh, I knew that I was just testing hundred percent I, glad you knew that. Yeah. I left the orange in the kitchen. Damnit. You can go get it if you want, but it's not worth it now, it probably wouldn't be. So, what's this one? Amarillo. So this, that's a Maro is the dark one. Looks like Amarillo looks like, like a, like a color one. Tell me you're from Eastern Kentucky without telling me you're from Eastern Oh, Amarillo. And so, so the, uh, the phony Negroni, I think that kind of looks like, um, a cherry seven up. You remember that Cherry seven up? It looks like a cherry seven up, right? dude. Yeah. So we're gonna try this like in Charlie Temple. Yeah. So we're doing these, trying them. Yeah. Simple. Oh, well we, we need to have something to be able to pour the, Woo. That's strong. then we'll pour it into the cup. Yeah. We have to make the alcoholic drink too there, bill, like pour. That's okay. We'll do a, we'll do a little, that's all right. We're just gonna drink straight bourbon. It's right gin. After that, we'll just try these and then we'll pour alcohol in them. It's okay. It's okay, bill. That's all right. So that's nice and floral. So which one did you go first? So I did the, uh, phony Negroni first. The pinky one? Yeah. That Negroni is, strong. yeah. that's, so that's something that's like, it's real bitter floral. The other one's like uh, the Maro, not Amaro, ro, right? It's right. It is like, uh, like a, niece, like it's like a little licorice we, did an episode on Amaro too. Um, was it the Japanese one or the Vietnamese one? We liked the I think it Was Vietnamese, The Vietnam, Japanese one. One was a Japanese. Okay. The Japanese one was real smoke. I'm sorry, the Vietnamese one was real smoky. It was, Well The Japanese was great then. was great. Yeah. So what do you all think of these non-alcoholic, uh, cocktails? I could do the marro I could not do the other one. Yeah, The same. It's just too bitter. Yeah, it's too bitter here, here's, here's what I enjoy about a well-made cocktail. Okay. Some people are not like this, making it, and I understand that making it actually is a big part of it, but like. When you drink a good cocktail. it's poor in there. You can taste the alcohol by tasting the alcohol. You're not chugging the drink. It forces you to drink, um, modestly. Do you understand what A hundred percent. Hundred percent. So like when you make a really good Manhattan, for example, right? You can taste that bourbon, you can taste, um, the other ingredients in there and it balances it out. But it's still, I mean, you're drinking alcohol, so it's a sipping beverage, correct? Yeah, When you drink a non-alcoholic beverage, and this has been universally for every non-alcoholic beverage I've had, which are in numeral, it, it, it amounts in the tens of beverages, right? That's, um, like there, it's like just drinking like soda or juice. Do you understand what I'm saying? I Greek, I do. a There's a lot going on right now. I feel like the going on. No, no. I'm, I'm a hundred percent fine. We're just making it's like you can't moderate your drinking when you're drinking non-alcohol. The alcohol is what helps you moderate the drinking. Well, I think, I think though in what would Moderat, I guess, yeah, the moderation is from like the bitterness. you could not drink. Like just gulp this down. what my, our neighbor Dave lives across the street. Crushes Negronis, I mean, crushes I think we had some at, uh, the Void with Brandon and Justin. did mean, I'm pretty sure we had some, um, we had a spaghetti, same thing, I which is, um, is it like a short version of spaghetti? It's Miller High Life. And, um, what's the Amaro that these, uh, AOL. Aperol a, I got Aperol Spritz with it's actually fantastic. It's actually fantastic. Yeah. Yeah, it's actually good. It's making a comeback. It's pretty popular. A baguette. But, one here though, I don't know, even with Jan and this now, I couldn't drink this fast. Yeah. I mean I just couldn't, I need to is a, this is a 45 minute not put gin in yours? I don't know. Did you? I thought I put gin in yours already. I also smell pickle on the really a little bit. Uh, Uh, yeah. I'm meant to bo is weird. No, straight up gin then. that. Do You smell pickle on the nose a little bit. I get it touch. I get it touch, yeah. a little cucumber. Yeah. It's not quite pickle, but it's definitely cucumber. for me. It's like deal, deal. feel like that cucumber, I feel like that comes from that gin I bet it does. Yeah. Okay. I can see that it's more cucumber. Yeah. This one here, the Amara falso or we putting bourbon in this one? Mm-hmm. Okay. So we're gonna use bourbon. My friends Try, try. After trying I wish I liked Jen more to give a better. Judge, it's not bad. I will say that. What's your of trying a non-alcoholic beverage without alcohol? Trying the same beverage with a little bit of alcohol. I'm not just talking about it's good or bad, like tell me how it makes you feel. The only thing I can, really compare that to is like, non-alcoholic beer and the couple, The handful of non-alcoholic beers I've had. uh, Mostly being athletic have actually been, pretty good. Yeah. I'd give this without alcohol. I'd give it a two with alcohol, I'd give it a three and a half. Right. So it's like, it's not terrible, It's probably fair, but it's also, it's like I could, I could drink it if I absolutely had to, but would I abide again. Probably not. Now this one in particular, I am did you taste that? Did you taste I've tried this one by itself. I did too. I did too. that? one I'm actually excited for just because I am also very excited for never say da our sponsor. you know? So I have to big hopes I have to sec. Sorry, Jason. I love this. Drew's pouring heavy. the, the heavy it slipped on. All gets alcohol. drink, what's going on? It hurts It hurts my heart so bad to get a heavy pour here. Here's the, here's the, I guess the bottom line. Okay, so now an alcoholic beverage, there's a market for that. And there's a time and a place. There's a, there is a Agreed. I feel like there's a time and a place I understand. Not wanting to drink in a social setting, alcohol, not wanna drink alcohol in a social setting, but wanting to still socialize. Yes. Okay. Um, I also get not wanting to do it for health reasons under any circumstances. Right. What I don't get is being forced to pay $20 for a non-alcoholic beverage where you're getting nothing out of it. Totally agree. I think, I think the only reason you can justify at least part of it is because of the, like, the labor that goes into it. So if you're actually making a mixed drink, with like. Fresh herbs and this, you gotta do this, you gotta muddle that, you gotta smoke it like whatever, you know what I mean? but that is the, is that the tip? Yes. Yes. But yes and no because, also, also I, but, but again though, if you're, if you're doing everything labor wise, you have to do to make the drink except pour that much gin into it. I mean, I I guess I, rec, I guess. I Understand it, but it's also like I'm not paying it. I look at it From a quality standpoint, if I'm getting the same quality of gin that I, or the same quality of non-alcoholic ingredients that I would, that gin, absolutely. But if I'm paying for a lenzo and black bean burger, uh, or you know, a black bean burger, I'm not gonna pay the same price that I would for a Wagyu smash burger. No. You shouldn't. No. You threw a fucking curve ball there. Yeah. And you tied it in. You did. I didn't. I was like, where That's my thing. Food is always the thing. that's great. But That's The thing, like if I'm buying a, that makes perfect sense to me. If I'm paying for a veggie sandwich, I'm not gonna pay the same price I would for Kobe beef. That's just the truth. So exactly Is it really worth it? Is it really worth paying the same price? Oh, I don't think so at all. And that's the thing, it's like I think they're trying to achieve parody to like, to elevate the cliche of a non-alcoholic beverage when in reality it's, I mean, there's nothing there. should just have a drink. You yeah. not a non-alcoholic drink, you should just have like a soda Or something like that. think about the people who are recovering alcoholics? absolutely. Well, here's what, here's what I'd say if I didn't want I think that's exactly what he just said. It's like you don't have to have a $15 cocktail that's like smoked and like, right, I agree. Chopped, diced, and covered what you want, that'ss fine. Yeah. But what if you're just make it yourself. I don't know. Last reference. I, I don't know what the price point is on these. I didn't pay for them. Uh, thanks I bet they're, I bet they're 10 bucks, each. Maybe 10 to right? They. No, they did not come in a four pack. They just came in a box. But, you know, you think a drink like this, it's like 6.8 ounces, I think, or seven ounces. So that's gonna be maybe two, two drinks. You know, I, I, I don't know. I mean, if you went out though, let's talk about you don't wanna drink alcohol. What would you order at a bar? Right. That's a great question. I know what I would order. I would probably order a, uh, soda with like some lime or some lemon. I'd do like a ginger ale with lime. I would think if they have it to Topo Chico. Yeah, like a little. t. So you took The words mouth, put a little lime in there. Soda water. Yep. Same. That's, fan. I mean, that's all you need. Like it looks carbonate. It's like a refreshing, you're not gonna slam it. Like it's just sipping on it. It's There's a mode of thought to where those types of people will, maybe they just want to venture out Those are called non alcoholics Yeah. Those type of people. Yeah. I'm trying to be, I don't know, don't, I'm trying be politically correct. Well, you know, when I look at like, Americans. that's true. It's like I get the same thing when I tell people, I'm like, I really like hot water. And they're like, What do you mean? I'm like, I really like hot water, Mm-hmm. like sparkling hot water sounds great. It, it tastes amazing. I've had Some good. ones, but that's exactly it. Like I've had some bad ones. People just like that sounds terrible to me. And I'm like, that sounds amazing. But also, I love sparkling water, so for me, I will, you have to like twist my arm to get me to drink tap water. Good. for the most part. I will drink it if, if I'm not thinking about it and I'm just like, oh, I'm thirsty. But for the most part, no, I will absolutely not. My wife drinks bottled water. I absolutely adore sparkling water. It is one of those things, apparently they got me, but it's, it's just a thing. It's like, it's, it's what you like, so it's the same thing with everything. I feel like if you're out in public, you don't have to have, at least for me. I found that like the laies hot water. Perfect. I can sit back, crush a couple of those in a. social setting and be completely content. Well, and they packaged some things to look like. Beers like Odus been doing it like Sharps, like all those I feel Like a lot of whatever. absolutely. There's so many non-alcoholic versions that taste like the thing that you've grown up drinking or had, grown up but they don't taste like it Well, there, there, there're 75% of it at best. Yes, yes. Best 50% but at best. 75. The best one you ever had? 75%, but I guess, okay. So the non-alcoholic Guinness, have you had that? I've actually Not had that actually take, that's like 90% Guinness. Really? That's the most impressive one I've ever had. Huh? Athletic. I think it tastes like shit terrible. That's unfortunate. Um, the Odos, all ones I've they all taste like shit. I've never had a good non-alcoholic never had a Hanukkah though. Fair. I like I the Heineken. na, Zero or, and, and I can understand why Guinness would make a good non-alcoholic. beer At this point. Like they've been, they've been doing it for but You know what's funny is that like there was a, there was a short period of time where I'm trying to be health conscious and it's like, when would, how long was that period? Is it a week or two? It was, it was like three days. But like, I'll be working, I'd be sitting on my computer and there was, you know, before I started like exercising. Yeah. And then to the next Easter Sunday. But like, uh, yeah, I would just like, I would go through like six or seven beers a night. I only 'cause I'd be working late, you know, and I was like, I gotta do something. So I started buying. easy to get down that road. It is. So I started buying some non-alcoholic beer and stuff to get into it. Guinness is the only one that I found that I liked and I actually enjoyed it. What was the, I would go through a four pack of Guinness and they're like the same price. They might be more expensive. like to try it. I never tried it. I would too. Yeah. I've never had it either after going through Guinness, after Guinness non-alcoholic for like a couple weeks. Like I got sick of it. Really? Like I just wanted a regular Guinness. I can't even put my finger on why? Because it tasted the same. Well, honestly, Like that's, you wanted dark beer is more alcohol fatigue. Yeah. And then Guinness, you think It's more alcohol, It's actually It's not. It is. Four two. Guinness is a four. Two. Yeah. Well so bar. It's so multi and I or multi is about, so, So what do you think Future? You think future. There's a future in NA I mean products like I feel like shelf space. of them increased for a while, but now it's like down like 50% of where it was. I think they're, yeah. I, I think where it is, I think it's outlandish. I think the spike in like these premium na cocktails I think is, is ridiculous. Um, this is my personal opinion. Like the pre-made ones? No. Like RTDs or at, at bar, at restaurants? Both. Both. Yeah. I think charging, paying a premium for non-alcoholic. Cocktails is, is ridiculous, and I think that's going to subside quickly. I agree with Matt in that aspect. I do think that the non-alcoholic market is going to slowly drift over into the cannabis market or ly. Yeah, That's actually that, actually I didn't even, honestly, I didn't even like, I didn't even draw but just because if you think about it, yeah, like you've said before, you can only drink so much. You are not drinking as much as you were before. I was just gonna it's a, it's a California sober, right? It is. Yeah. I was just gonna say, the people that are drinking na, like Highend na beverages are just going to go back to what they're used to, which might be a ginger ale and lime or topo Chico. Well, 'cause 'cause they're likes it's so expensive to, I don't wanna pay $20 for something. I'm getting nothing out. That was a fun experiment. Let me just get my sparkly I think The biggest thing right now in 2025 is it's all fads. It's all What's the hype? What do you try that's like, oh, you know, take tax greens, baby. Of course. Um, I'm gonna go be at this party. I don't wanna be the odd man out who doesn't have anything. Even though it's perfectly fine to be the guy without anything, but it's like, I don't, but I don't wanna be, you know, it's like nobody wants to There's a social So it's, it always falls into that thing of like, Ooh, you know, I'll stand and hold one of these. Five 15 milligram, you know? So I just, I always think that. Eventually the non-alcoholic scene will probably slowly, there will always be somebody there, but it's gonna, it's gonna drift away. pretty quickly. I think the younger generation though, will like at least people might shine away from alcohol too. I think the dirty soda trim we talked about a few Episodes back. I think that's actually gonna be more prevalent. Yep. Than Like having a cocktail that's like non-alcoholic, like I'd rather pay $6 for dirty soda the way I want it, right. Versus 14 for a negroni that tastes. I mean, yeah. Like how do you make it taste good? Look at what people, are paying for coffee your point, it's just like if I'm not gonna get the benefits of alcohol, like I want the benefits of sugar. You know what I mean? There is a certain euphoria, caffeine, alcohol makes you feel good. Sugar makes you feel, good. it does, yeah. They're both bad for you, just in different ways. But you know what, forget caffeine. Like I threw in there too. The number one drug with alcohol? Oh my I just saying Heart pal palpitations or something like that. Pal Fo Loko went so hard they got banned and then came back. Like, I mean, it's real, like It's a real thing. know, we should try. There's, uh, something, uh, from the UK called Buck Fast. I've never heard of it. Let's try it. Oh god. of that. Yeah. Okay, we so, oh, go ahead. I was gonna say we did a whole episode of Fest. Bell Fire. Well, so what do you guys, has anybody had a Negroni before tonight? Okay. Okay. Yeah. What'd you How, how close was this to close? No. No. Okay. It didn't have, didn't have the bite of the, the alcohol was too much like bitter, too floral. Okay. much like not bitter? No, it wasn't oh, I think it's bitter. I think Too much of the mix versus, you know, even, even with the alcohol, it still didn't really bounce out official, but now, the tomorrow. I think that's pretty good. That's obvious, especially with Okay. So yeah, this, this MRO with the Without flip side. Which one? no, no, no. one. That's, that's, The negro. That's the ne grown. Yeah. Sorry. The phone negroni without the alcohol, I thought tasted like some sort of Grenadine Laed Yeah. Yes. Okay. I actually did not think it was bitter. I think it could have been more bitter. I did not think it was bitter. Like I've had, like, you know, the real thing and you can actually tell the difference when you put the gin in that. This is a great beverage. It's pretty good. Alcohol and the on alcohol thing, I love this. I think it's, no, it's, oh yeah, I get the deal. on the notes. I've never had an agro though, so I guess that's the thing. for me is I'm not a hundred percent familiar for, to start, I'm gonna disagree with it, but I understand it. I mean, I understand what you're saying. I just think probably like a Mario, better than the, than the green bottom line. I'm with you. I'm surprised how much, but also, once again, I also don't like Jen. Yeah. I'm, I actually I almost get like root beer from, I'm getting better with, from Negro with with the bourbon. Yep. Yeah. I thought the Negroni one was, was really well put together and adding some bourbon to it. I know. Sacrilege for non-alcoholic drink. I thought that was actually, yeah, man, it was the spot that was. spot on the way to go. But thanks for sharing. I mean, I think there's a place for these, it's just like what place in the market is it? I don't know. I think it's actually shrinking a little bit. I think with the THC seltzers you said, Okay. and also just the uh, honestly, just the RTD. cocktails. I mean, you know, lower Topo Chico, even without any alcohol at all. Like, Well, they're, they're competing now for the same market of people or people who are shifting to that side, right? And so you gotta think, okay, well, can I get a little bit of a buzz maybe from a THC seltzer versus nothing? And hell, the THC seltzer might be less expensive, honestly. is. I mean, that's the bank. it's probably a third cost. Really? That's what, yeah. And that's also, it's probably eight bucks versus 20. you know, or eight. Eight bucks for 15. Also healthier for you in the long run. So it's like, you know, As much as I love to sit here and be like, never say die, please give me, more of this bourbon uh, hemp botanical form. Maybe So you wanna venture venture out, I mean, you want to get creative, I'm just saying. But your bourbon is amazing. Yeah. At the end of the day, I think, um, like there's alcoholic beverages get complacent Be creative. there's non-alcoholic beverages. Yeah. Always seek more. Yeah, Everything that's has alcohol in it has alcohol. Literally everything else is a non-alcoholic beverage. We don't need to call it non-alcoholic, that's the thing. It's just like water is a fucking non-alcoholic I'm drinking non-alcoholic orange juice. It's called orange juice. I mean, yeah. it's like we gotta go that far. It's just like, why do we have to like, make it a thing? Like it's not a thing, it's just, yeah. I, I think it's good at this point. It's, they're trying to divide us. I we're making kid beer. It's, it, You know, it's like, oh, well don't worry, don't worry. You know, Jeffrey, it's fine. You know what? They need to get off my lawn. You need to get off my lawn. We are all one people. Yeah, yeah guys, thanks for tuning in. If you like that, please share it. If not, then get outta here For more arsenic culture, you can check out off my lawn, all the associates we are @arsenicculture, like and subscribe on YouTube, and we'll see you on the next one.